Talk:Sparda
I would like to know where the info for the "Pre-Games" section has come from. It needs to reflect the source of the information, or if there is no specific place it has come from, then it should be made clear that this is the generally agreed upon backstory for the fandom. I'll hold off on editing it for right now. Emperor Moses 20:24, 27 September 2007 (UTC) Trivia For the "Trivia" section, I think you should put down something about Sparda's name possibly being a pun on "Spada," the Italian word for "sword," which kinda makes sense, since his sword is named "Sparda." Dethklok91 (talk) 04:35, August 31, 2012 (UTC) Sparda=Jesus Should any mention be made of Sparda's quite obviously being a reference to Jesus? The whole "gave up his power to defeat Lucifer, 2000 years ago, entered the human world through blood of a priestess Mary, is expected to come again to rule over the world." thing seems quite obviously to imply that Sparda was supposed to be Jesus. It would also fit in very well with the allusions to the Divine Comedy inherent in the series.KrytenKoro 20:31, 18 February 2008 (UTC) :Or...maybe Sparda was derived from the empire of Sparta! Just kidding though.--NeloAngelo 08:21, 19 February 2008 (UTC) Legendary Dark Knight Both because the costume in DMC3 is named Legendary Dark Knight Dante, and because Vergil wears approximately the same costume as "Corrupt Vergil", it seems pretty clear that it is merely Dante being snazzy, not Sparda himself.KrytenKoro 19:24, 19 February 2008 (UTC) No, that is what Sparda looks like. If you played through DMC1 on HARD MODE, you unlock Legendary Dark Knight Mode''In it you play as Sparda wielding Yamato . Both costumes are the same from DMC1 and DMC3. And if you notice in both games, when you play in that costume/mode, Dante's shadow changes to that of Sparda's demon form. User:LustDemon 12:57, 10 March 2009 (GMT) :I was not aware that the Legendary Dark Knight in DMC1 was confirmed as Sparda - merely that he wielded the Yamato. But regardless, the point here is that the picture used in this article is from DMC3, when it is said to be "Legendary Dark Knight Dante" - and Vergil wears the same costume. As for Dante having Sparda's shadow - he does that as DMC1 Dante as well, and it's a main plot point in DMC1. It doesn't mean he's actually Sparda.Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 06:27, 11 March 2009 (UTC) ::I don't know where your getting your sources, but that is not a main plot point at all in DMC1, his shadow has nothing to do with the plot. And if you have played through the game, Dante's shadow is the same until you play Legendary Dark Knight Mode. That is Sparda, his shadow is that of his demon form. The same as in DMC3 when you play with his costume. It has been agreed upon by the fan community that this is what Sparda looked like and Capcom has not stated anything that says different since the costume remains the same in both games. Vergil wears the same costume as Sparda, because it's a play on how he believes that he is Sparda's only true heir. ::Assuming Sparda's demon form isn't a major plot point in DMC1? Huh. ::Again, when playing as DMC1 Dante in DMC3, you also have Sparda's shadow, and the name of the costume is clearly "Legendary Dark Knight Dante". ::Honestly, I don't give a damn what the "fan community" has agreed. They're wrong on nearly everything anyway, and to be reliable this wiki needs to be based on the info which comes from Capcom - which labels that image as ''Dante in a costume. If you'd like to use the Legendary Dark Knight image from DMC1, that should be fine for now, but the whole point of this discussion was to explain that the DMC3 image isn't accurate.Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 07:03, 12 March 2009 (UTC) :: ::Okay, I'm gonna end this right here and now. When you go to Sparda in either dmc1 or 3, does it say "dante in a sparda suit?" no! it states "legendary dark knight" in the first one, and quite plainly calls him Sparda in number 3. Now, on to the "major plot point" in devil may cry 1. Yes assuming Sparda's demonic aura is a big part of the game, but assuming his shadow (which is what you said at first) is not. The only reason why dmc1 dante has that shadow is to reference the one fight in dmc 1 where Dante's demonic aura finally grew to reflect that of his father. This is also why he turns into his Sparda like form when you go into devil trigger. Whether you wish to accept it or not, that is Sparda, not Dante playing dress up. the proof of this (if you want to get meticulous about it) is in the guns you use. When playing as Sparda, Dante's Ebony and Ivory tend to change their names. Now since it is a major point in more than one dmc game that ebony and ivory are Dante's signature handguns, I highly doubt he just up and buys new ones every time he puts on a different outfit. Finally, if you still are unconvinced of dmc1's legendary dark knight, examine Yamato. This is a sword that Sparda gave Vergil, not Dante, and Vergil appeared only as Nero Angelo in the game, wielding a sword three times Yamato's size. So unless Arkham got some major plastic surgery, donned a white wig, purple coat and stylish monocle, there really is noone else besides Sparda that had even touched Yamato at that point. Oh, and by the way, more often than not companies base the direction they take game plots in on what the fans know to be true. And as alwayse there's the golden rule, if enough people believe it, it's as good as true whether it's correct or not. sathan101 June/03/10 5:17AM ::In DMC3, it's called "Legendary Dark Knight Dante". It's Dante as he is dressed in the future, just like "Corrupted Vergil". It's each of them wearing the same clothes. ::I don't give a crap about the DMC1 situation, because it's not the same thing. The DMC3 costume doesn't have the Yamato, and still uses the Ebony & Ivory. So it has Sparda's shadow-big whoop. Dante had his shadow in DMC1, didn't make him his father, and guess what? He's Sparda's child. It makes perfect sense that he'd end up looking more like his father. ::If you honestly believe those last few lines you wrote, you shouldn't be editing a wiki, or trying to provide "information" to anyone.Glorious CHAOS! 18:13, June 3, 2010 (UTC) :: ::it does not say legendary dark knight Dante in DMC3 it very clearly says Sparda or "super Sparda". Even in devil may cry 1 the character is called the Legendary Dark Knight, period. The legendary dark knight Dante just something Trish playfully calls him in the final moments of DMC1. And just so you are thuroughly aware, Dante has never appeared in an outfit like Spardas in any game unless you are playing as the Sparda character for that game. as he grows he keeps to the red outfits which are his trademark. The only reason Vergil wears Sparda's robe is to reference that he's trying in every way to emulate his father's power. If you look at corrupted Vergil without devil trigger on, the monocle which Sparda bore is missing. This is proof that they are not only not the same character, but their character models were even made different. If you want to see what Dante looks like in the future, get devil may cry two or four. Those are Dante in the future, and they clearly have no resemblance to Sparda's outfit, least of all in his devil form. In dmc2 dante looks more like a fallen angel when in devil trigger, and a hornless, wingless devil in dmc4. Never once in those future installments does it show Dante rocking the purple robe, and since force edge was lost when it turned into Sparda, and Sparda itself was given to Trish, I don't see any reason to assume that the man wielding force edge in the purple coat and monocle is anyone other than Sparda. I will however say this about the pic. If I am correct, the picture they are using is of Arkham when he took Force Edge and temporarily assumed Sparda's demonic aura, so while your assumption that Sparda is just Dante getting fancy is wrong, you very well might be correct about the picture being wrong. sathan101 June/03/10 2:17 PM :The official DMC3 site calls it "Legendary Dark Knight Dante", just like it is "Corrupt Vergil". It's Dante wearing Sparda's costume, just like Corrupt Vergil is Vergil wearing Sparda's costume. They are not canonical characters - they are costumes. Furthermore, Dante has taken Sparda's form while in Devil Trigger before, there's no reason to assume he can't again. The Sparda has become the Force Edge before, there's no reason to assume it is "lost". :If you can provide some screenshot that says "Super Sparda" or something, then I'll admit I'm wrong and apologize, but so far, all I've seen that gives an official name is the DMC3 site, so we're using that.Glorious CHAOS! 06:48, June 5, 2010 (UTC) : :how about this, play the game, unlock him for yourself, and tell me what it says on the game. Until then, stop your pointless arguing and accept that you are mistaken this time Sathan101 10:16, June 5, 2010 (UTC) ::No. The article's info must be sourced - if I'm wrong, I'll admit it, but you need to provide a screenshot or citation. I've checked many videos on youtube, and so far they only say "You've earned a new costume," without naming it. When I play my file that has it, it doesn't name the costume. The only actual name that I've seen for it so far "Legendary Dark Knight Dante", on the official website (which uses the correct name for every other image it has on its site). I'm willing to admit if I'm wrong, since I'm relying on what the website says - but not unless I see some evidence. ::I did just remember though - Dante's Majin Form in DMC2, a canon form, looks very similar to Sparda's demon form. Sooo...it's very possible.Glorious CHAOS! 16:40, June 5, 2010 (UTC) Article Name Why does "Sparda" redirect to "The Dark Knight Sparda"? I could understand the article name if "Sparda" was a disambiguation page but it isn't. The article should just be "Sparda". :Because I originally planned to merge them, and when that wouldn't work, I forgot to dab it.KrytenKoro 04:47, 30 May 2008 (UTC) ::To successfully rename the page, delete this page first since it is just a disambiguation page and disambiguation pages have become obsolete since wikia changed their coding stuff and sh*t (If you want to keep the disambig page, maybe this title would fit: Sparda (disambiguation)). Then, after that is done, this page can now be renamed to Sparda. [[User:Steamygoreng|'sΓΣamy']][[User_Talk:Steamygoreng|'Goreng']] 04:00, January 27, 2013 (UTC) :::They're not really obsolete, since they can provide alternatives besides exact spellings. (Like, "you typed Sparda, you may have meant Sparda demon, Sparda weapon, or the Spada item). Just keep it the way it is, it makes it easier for people to find.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 15:09, January 27, 2013 (UTC) Refs *''Devil May Cry 3: Dante's Awakening, '''Character — Sparda': "The legendary dark knight who defeated the Devil-king some 2000 years ago. When sealing the netherworld, sensing his power had grown too strong, he intentionally seals himself in as well." Sparda did not seal himself in the demon world That the character file (or something?) says otherwise is contradicted within the game itself by Lady's narration, which only mentioned his power being sealed (and is the new reference), and Arkham telling the same story in the DMC3 manga: "Fearing his awesome power, he sealed away not only the demons, but his own sword and powers." Nothing about him imprisoning himself in the demon world. What would have been the point of that if he was going to escape anyway? Morgan Evans (talk) 09:49, February 2, 2013 (UTC) :According to DMC2, he sealed himself in as well, but did manage to come back.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 18:31, February 2, 2013 (UTC) ::Now, sealing his power doesn't "directly contradict" that he sealed himself in as well. What we'd need to find is a serial after DMC2 stating "he absolutely did not seal himself in as well", and then we'd have a useable retcon. Unless we can find that, we have to resign ourselves to just saying he sealed both his power and himself in the demon world.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 18:40, February 2, 2013 (UTC) ::Except that in DMC2, Lucia compares Dante's sealing and return specifically to one of Sparda's when he encountered Argosax, and nothing in DMC2 states that that event happened at the same exact time as the Temen-ni-Gru, while the article here conflates both Sparda sealing his power and sealing himself as one and the same event with absolutely no proof in dialogue. They're not the same thing. He sealed his power first, then ''he went into the demon world sometime later (centuries later, possibly) to destroy Argosax and eventually resurfaced in the human world. The only reference that says he did both at once (supposedly his character file?) is, again, contradicted in the same game it's in by one source (Lady) and then in supplementary material by another (Arkham), and both say that just his power was trapped in the demon world and that he lived the rest of his days on the human side with no reference to Argosax whatsoever. Morgan Evans (talk) 18:22, February 3, 2013 (UTC) :::Except the game doesn't say anything like "he got sealed because of Argosax". It merely says that Sparda also went into the Demon World when he knew he couldn't get back (closest quote to what you're saying is a vague "You must not worry, my dear; I am sure that he will return. Everything is just as it was with Sparda." :::I've combed the entire script of DMC3, and it says nothing like "Sparda sealed away his power, but not himself". As I said earlier, it says that he sacrificed his own power and the blood of a mortal priestess to seal the tower. The manual to the game even states that he sought to seal himself in as well, and his character file within the game says it too. :::Like I said: provide a ''direct quote from a canon source stating unequivocally that Sparda did not seal himself in (the ones you've provided above are unusable both because they do not say what you're claiming, and that, heck, they come from the game's liar and fool), or come to grips with the fact that Sparda's history is intentionally vague, and the character quotes within the game are going to be inaccurate or contradictory at times.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 20:47, February 3, 2013 (UTC) :::::Matier wanted to tell Dante a story about Sparda if/when he succeeded in stopping Arius from resurrecting Argosax. As Dante is about to leave to the Underworld to stop Argosax ''and knowing there's a chance he might not return, Lucia asks him if he wanted to hear the story about Sparda from Matier, and his response is '"I know... he did the same thing."' Then Matier shows up and says that '"Everything is just as it was with Sparda", to which Lucia makes the late realization that '''"Wait, Sparda DID come back". :::::You're assuming that for whatever reason despite the script or plot of DMC3 not being planned or even thought of yet, that Matier would have wanted to talk to Dante about the time Sparda supposedly sealed himself in along with his powers an event unrelated to the one she'd most likely have knowledge of, or that Dante would say that Sparda "did the same thing" despite what Sparda did having nothing to do with what Dante's doing at that moment, or that Matier would say "Everything is just as it was with Sparda" when Dante is doing something different than what Sparda did when Matier knew him, and that Lucia would also know anything about it. This is impossible. She was going to talk to him about the time Sparda fought against Argosax, referred to in the game's manual as a "recent tale, only a few hundred years old, of a great swordsman appearing from "the outside" to aid in exorcizing the most evil gods of all time", and Dante knew how it went because he was repeating the same actions Sparda took, and Lucia notes that Sparda came back from that exorcism. :::::The opening narration of DMC3 by Lady has her talking about the legend of Sparda sealing the Temen-ni-Gru, a different event, as she heard it: "Long ago, in ancient times, a demon rebelled against his own kind for the sake of the human race. With his sword, he shut the portal to the demonic realm, and sealed the evil entities off of our human world. But since he was a demon himself, his power was also trapped on the other side. I've never believed it. I always thought it was just a child's fairy tale. But I discovered that this so-called legend wasn't a myth at all. Sparda existed." :::::Arkham has no reason to lie to anyone about what happened to Sparda, as whether or not Sparda sealed himself up along with his power two millenia ago had absolutely no bearing at all on the unsealing method for the Temen-ni-Gru itself. He has two chances to refer to that, both when telling Lady about the story and when telling Vergil about it, and fails to mention it at all to either of them. :::::There's a clear timeline. Sparda sealing his power (NOT himself) along with the tower using his blood and the blood of a priestess happened two thousand years before modern time. His dealing with Argosax and sealing himself (the only noted instance of him doing so) is more recent in comparison, only a few centuries before the modern time. His history being vague is no excuse to mix together the two events in a way that makes no narrative sense when they're defined as separate events. Morgan Evans (talk) 23:01, February 3, 2013 (UTC) ::And you're assuming that the game is lying except when you want it to support you. ::Here's what we have: :::DMC2 says that Sparda was trapped in the demon world, but escaped. It does not explicitly say this was during a battle with Argosax, it only implies that the Vii de Marlii are aware of the incident somehow. :::The DMC3 character file for Sparda says he sealed himself in the demon world while sealing the Temen-ni-gru. :::The DMC3 manual says that Sparda sought to seal himself away forever in the demon world AND sealed away his power. :::Arkham and Lady both say that Sparda sealed away his power in the demon world, but do not mention what happened to Sparda afterwards. ::You're imagining that those contradict each other, when they don't. All they have to mean is that Sparda sealed away his power in the demon world, and sealed himself away. You're also putting interpretation into what Matier meant, which hell, you might be right, but it's still an assumption. ::So, again: we have a source in a previous game (debatably could have been retconned), and two sources within the game in question that are portrayed as "Word of God", and then two sources within that same game which don't necessarily contradict the Word of God sources, and yet even then are portrayed repeatedly as hearsay and legend, by a character who is repeatedly hoodwinked and a character that is a continuous liar. They are thus an "unreliable narrator" sort of source, and have to be backed up by more authoritative sources...like the out-of-universe Character Files. ::To be frank, your argument as it is doesn't have a leg to stand on. You are trying to rely on assumptions and implications to convince the wiki, when all the other side has to do is say "looky here, DMC3 explicitly says Sparda was sealed in". The only hope for your claim is to demonstrate an explicit retcon, and as I said before, Arkham and Lady talking about Sparda's power but not Sparda himself is not that. I've not combed through the Japanese scripts for the games or manga, so there's a chance you'll find something there. And hey, if I missed a quote not discussed above, that could be good too. But if you're just relying on those quotes above, then I'm sorry, the game says you're wrong. ::Yes, without the explicit phrasing of the manual and character file, your interpretation would make more sense. However, once you've eliminated the impossible and all that.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 06:43, February 4, 2013 (UTC) ::DMC2 says that Sparda went to perform an exorcism to banish Argosax, and that at some point he was sealed and escaped. The incident with Argosax is the simplest to assume that both these events happened in since the Vie du Marli clan would have been aware of it having been part ''of the banishment of Argosax, and Matier would have firsthand knowledge. You're ''assuming that they were retroactively aware of Sparda sealing himself during the Temen-ni-Gru event 2000 years prior even though technically that event didn't even exist in the plot yet, and was retconned into existence later on. DMC3's existence still does not magically make itself fit into DMC2's backstory. Sparda sealed himself along with Argosax, Dante does the same, "Everything is as it was with Sparda" , and Sparda escaped, hinting at Dante's eventual escape. End of story. ::The character file says that he sealed himself with the Temen-ni-Gru. The manual does not, and you are lying about it. There is only one source in the character file, and two characters say that he sealed his power and do not mention what happened afterwards even though there is no reason for them to omit this information. Lady heard it from Arkham, but just because Arkham is a liar does not mean he lies about absolutely everything. That's idiotic logic. ::This isn't the first time a character file was blatantly wrong about something; Lady is entirely human and supposedly of "weak flesh and blood", but gets stabbed straight through the leg and gets back up later without limping, being paralyzed entirely, or bleeding out, gets two grown men kicked at her and gets back up from that too, proceeds to climb up an entire side of tower for a mission or so, and is up for a boss fight with Dante with her biggest issue simply being "ran out of breath". This is "weak" for you. ::Sparda sealing himself in the Demon World still makes absolutely no narrative sense. If he feared his power, he would not seal himself in WITH his power, in the same world that is the SOURCE of his powers. He would have cut himself off completely from it, and the dialogue in-game and the manga say that he did just that. You're saying that after sealing up the Emperor of the Underworld, stopping the demons from invading the humans, and essentially committing treason against his own kind, that he cut himself off from his power and locked himself in with the same demons he just finished betraying that likely hold a grudge against him. If you actually think that's true and believe one line of a character file at the expense of the game's actual plot and cutscenes along with supplementary material, then you're wrong. The game and manga show 'that you are wrong. Morgan Evans (talk) 14:59, February 4, 2013 (UTC) :This is a wiki. Any one fan's interpretation of the published material, which is what your argument consist of, is worth jack-shit compared to the published source, ''even if the fans think the official story doesn't make sense. I get that you think it doesn't make sense: I agree. What I'm trying to impress upon you is. That 'it doesn't matter what we think. :Your aside about lady is not only irrelevant, but doesn't prove anything. It is a purely subjective view on your own part. :As for your claim that I'm lying: [[User:KrytenKoro/DMC Notes|I've transcribed about all of the manual texts, and I absolutely does say that sparda sought to seal himself away, and sealed his power]]. Please retract your false accusation. :Last time I'll repeat myself: please provide direct evidence of a retcon vis-a-vis Sparda categorically -not- getting sealed away, or stop wasting the wiki's time. I've repeatedly explained why your argument cannot be considered valid per wiki standards, and all you're doing now is resorting to emotional arguments and accusations.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 21:28, February 4, 2013 (UTC) :Right. I just clicked the link. It leads to DMC1 transcripts of in-game text from when Dante examines items, doors, and objects. Nothing to do with DMC3, whose instruction manual's text starts with "Several thousand years have passed since the demon warrior Sparda used his legendary sword for the good of humans and sealed away the human world". Nothing about sealing himself. Just that he sealed away the human world from the demons. Morgan Evans (talk) 23:48, February 4, 2013 (UTC) :Sorry, I posted the wrong one. Here. 00:34, February 5, 2013 (UTC) ::Actually, I just found another one that explicitly says he left hell after sealing Mundus and "many bloody battles", also from the '''DMC3 manga's introduction. :::"Sparda cut down the armies of hell and defeated the Demon King, sealing him into oblivion. Although Sparda was himself a demon, his desire to experience the pain and joy of a human soul turned him against the demons. After many bloody battles, he departed hell to reside in the human world. He even married a human woman, who bore his seed." ::So that, as well. 00:37, February 5, 2013 (UTC) :::Here's the one in the DMC3 manual, to make it easier: ::::"Then greatly fearing his own accursed power, Sparda sought to seal himself away forever with the demons. The key to that seal was the great tower. Sparda, in the depths of the tower, let flow his own blood and the blood of a pure maiden, and in doing so, he sealed away the demons — and his own power — forever." (Point being that this passage does not portray these two events as conflicting, and mentions both of them in the same context) :::By the way, these two passages are portrayed as forbidden Vatican texts, meaning these are basically the entire canon source of Arkham and thus Lady's knowledge of Sparda.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 00:46, February 5, 2013 (UTC) ::::Actually, that brings to mind another thing. If Sparda gave up all of his power, like DMC3 harps on, how the heck did he defeat Argosax? I mean, it's explicit that he saved Dumary Island long after he sealed away the Temen-ni-gru, but seriously, that makes no sense. That's not even an interpretation: the plot of Sparda makes no sense. I mean, unless he used purely human strength to do so, which is unlikely.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 01:32, February 5, 2013 (UTC) ::::That he sought ''to seal himself away with the demons doesn't necessarily mean that he ''succeeded ''in doing so, and his sealing away his powers would make trapping himself with the demons redundant/unnecessary. The only certain thing is that he cut himself off from his powers by the end of it, not that he locked himself on the same side as everything that'd try to kill him in his weakened state. ::::Pretty sure he split his power between the Force Edge and the halves of the Perfect Amulet, with the amulet housing enough of his power for him to tap into whenever he needed to, but let's assume DMC3's section of lore is entirely true. If he did seal ''all ''of his power into the Force Edge and rendered himself effectively human, then forget defeating Argosax, how did he live for two straight millenia, and how did his children inherit demonic powers at all that would manifest as early as their childhood (according to Dante)? It'd be one thing if he suppressed his powers while still having them, but he cut himself off from it "forever" and "died as a man", so how does that work? Let's be honest, the lore is fine until DMC3 retcons it. None of the "sealing all of his power" business is even hinted at until then. It makes more sense if 3 is ignored so that he kept his own powers, merely split the power of the Sparda sword into the amulets, and kept the (then sleeping) Force Edge with him to hand down to Dante. Morgan Evans (talk) 23:49, February 6, 2013 (UTC) :::::As to the first, I've already responded to that several times. The second we start throwing out sources because we don't like their implications, especially ones portrayed as WoG, there's really no point in arguing canonicity anymore. I mean, throw out a source because WoG said it wasn't supposed to be part of the story, or it's been explicitly retconned like with DmC. :::::Yeah, DMC2, DMC3, and most of the prequel literature are pretty incompatible.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 06:57, February 7, 2013 (UTC) Disappearance of Sparda Found line in article "Many believe he died, although in DMC2 Dante hints he may have passed into another realm." Checked DMC2 script twice didn't find anything. Maybe I miss something? Flia 17:37, 16 January 2009 (UTC) :I'll check in a second, but I think it was actually Lucia hinting (comparing Dante's escape to a hypothetical one of Sparda's).Not even Mr. Lister's Koromon survived intact. 18:53, 16 January 2009 (UTC) "you are just like he was" in dmc4 berial says that but what evidence do we have that specifically states that he's reffering to sparda because he has been in hell for the last two thousand years for all we know he could have met vergil in hell or something and people tend to put things that berial said together to form a statement like some of the pages say that berial said "there was no human the likes of you the last time except for him" and some say "i have never seen any human such as you excpet for him but i've played berial more than a few times and he says before he fights nero "there was no one the likes of you last time" or something close to that then after the fight he says "you are just like he was" to me reading this about people saying it means he fought sparda i think thats a bit of a long shot it's possible yes but as we know there are four people with the blood of sparda in dmcverse 2 of which are MIA (Sparda, Vergil) the other two are in the human world (Dante, Nero) while we don't know exactly what nero's relation to sparda is as of yet but we do know he has sparda's blood as said in dmc4 many times but any ways what do we really know of what berial said he never really suggested anyone he just said "you are just like he was" which we do not know who "he" is 22:21, June 7, 2010 (UTC) :Vergil's dead. Mundus killed him, according to the official storyline. :While your argument is not bad, a main goal of the game is to paint Nero as the successor of Sparda, and the whole "Berial was there 2000 years ago", "there was no human like you", and "you are like he was" point pretty clearly to him talking about the ''demon, Sparda.Glorious CHAOS! 02:29, June 8, 2010 (UTC) Sparda is technically a playable character and a Boss Sparda is a playable character in DMC 3 where you use the cheat in the game and you play with super sparda Dante which devil trigger is Sparda himself. Also Sparda is in a way a boss in DMC 3 where Arkham recieves his power from the Force edge. :Well, Dante's costume actually being Sparda is one way of look at it, but it's really just a costume--a bonus feature--not Sparda himself. There is no game where Sparda appears as a playable character, unlike Dante, Lucia, Trish, Vergil, or Nero. :And Arkham's blob form is just that: Arkham's Blob Form. Arkham attempted to control the power of Sparda the sword and failed: The Legendary Dark Knight himself is not in the picture. --Anobi 04:14, January 17, 2012 (UTC) Devil appearance which his sons inherited Speaking about Sparda having 2 sons and his sons inherited demonic powers from him, their Devil Triggers are also linked to Sparda; *Vergil (and his dark ego, Nelo Angelo) had ram-like horns, like Sparda, and had Dante even developed these horns? *Dante's Majin Form has him reptilian arms and feet, and four wings, like his father (although Sparda had 2 wings?) *Sparda's chest mark is resembled with Dante's Los Illuminados-like crest in his DMC4 Devil Trigger *Nero's DT is from the armor of Nelo Angelo, but with some resemblance to Sparda KevzMarz 04:09, January 21, 2012 (UTC) Devil May Cry: Sparda's Story Thumbs up if anyone want to see a Devil May Cry: Sparda's Story. Here you play as Sparda and the game tells the story of Sparda, such as meeting Dante's and Vergil's mother, why he sealed the gate between Earth and Hell, and a bunch of other stuff. Leave a message if anyone agrees. William J. Hawkins 22:45, February 26, 2012 (UTC) :^_^d --Anobi 03:41, February 27, 2012 (UTC) :Oh hell yes. bO_Od Double thumbs up. ^,...,^ (talk) 23:25, January 25, 2013 (UTC) DmC Should we add DmC to his article since it is confirmed that he is Dante's(DmC) father and left the Rebellion for him? plothole? The book of ancient legend states that he impregnated a woman and fathered twin sons, yet Vergil and Dante were young men in DMC3... unless Sparda had other wives and children before EvaElveonora (talk) 20:55, January 25, 2013 (UTC) :It's generally accepted that Dante and Vergil are Sparda's only children, making the "legend" much younger than many are lead to believe. Though, there's really nothing to stop anyone from believing otherwise. Anything's possible with demonic power! :) --Anobi (talk) 02:39, January 28, 2013 (UTC) ::Or that they are very old already, maybe. In DmC, however, the implication is that he got married very recently, or was married to Eva for a LONG time before having kids.(ಠ_ೃ)﻿ Bully! 02:57, January 28, 2013 (UTC) God As Sparda has defeated 2 gods (Mundus and Argosax) and Arkham describes the power of Sparda as godly and would allow him to become a god, should we rank Sparda a god? LegionZero (talk) 20:23, April 11, 2019 (UTC) :No. Evil Tim (talk) 20:29, April 11, 2019 (UTC) ::If you are going to participate on this page you are going to have to present argument and evidence as to why. LegionZero (talk) 21:22, April 11, 2019 (UTC) :::I am tempted to butt in with another reply made just of "No" - just because I agree with Tim and simply to annoy you while at it, but I really shouldn't. I played too much of these games, I have the urges to taunt people all the time. :::Anyway, this topic has been discussed enough elsewhere, I am not going to repeat my full argumentation here, but yeah, basically... :::No. My signature is NOT short! 22:48, April 11, 2019 (UTC) Knighthood While serving under Mundus he was most definitely a knight but since defecting would he still be considered a knight? He became a Lord and a knight is suppose to be a soldier for a lord/monarch. After leaving the Dark Army, would his occupation still be considered a knight? LegionZero (talk) 05:54, April 12, 2019 (UTC) :Well, he's called the legendary dark knight by humans and demons, so presumably he retained that title. Knights can also be lords, that's a real thing from feudal-era Europe, someone who was both would be addressed as "knight, lord of" and then the name of his manor. Most medieval lords were knights, but not all knights were lords. Hell, all of England's middle-ages Kings from William I up to Richard III were also knights. Evil Tim (talk) 06:41, April 12, 2019 (UTC) ::Solid. Now what of his disappearance and reappearance? Would this carry over once the medieval ways were done away with? He would no longer serve in some kind of army. LegionZero (talk) 06:51, April 12, 2019 (UTC) :::Knighthoods are usually permanent (sometimes even hereditary) unless you disgrace yourself in some way, and I imagine saving the entire world earns you a few unannounced holidays with no questions asked. Also, given Fortuna doesn't seem to have ever got rid of knightly traditions, I'd imagine at least there his title would retain its full meaning rather than becoming purely honorary. Particularly since their military still use swords. Evil Tim (talk) 07:10, April 12, 2019 (UTC) ::::While I don't have anything constructive to add to this conversation, I have to note that I never thought of it this way before. "Legendary Dark Knight" was kind of a flavor title to me all this time. It's interesting to think about, thanks. My signature is NOT short! 11:22, April 12, 2019 (UTC) :::: Sparda is referred to in japanese as 魔剣士 (makenshi) - Devil Swordsman, i.e. the one who proficient with a (devil) sword, not as 騎士 (kishi) - Knight, title by which Angelos and members of the Order are referred. So I think we should take 'the Legendary Dark Knight' title as a poetic translation and not the evidence that he actually was knighted, let alone list that as 'occupation'. Davidhater (talk) 17:02, April 12, 2019 (UTC) :::::Japanese title doesn't really matter because like Resident Evil, the Japanese dub of DMC games is actually done after the English one. The principle issue is that "swordsman" is not a word that describes an occupation in English. It's like listing his occupation as "hammerer" or "pot heater." Evil Tim (talk) 07:03, April 13, 2019 (UTC) ::::::Is there any reason it can't be? Carpenter, ironworker, painter, etc etc are all occupations. Theoretically a swordsman can be an occupation. We could list both. LegionZero (talk) 07:25, April 13, 2019 (UTC) :::::::Well it's more like describing him as a "gunman." It's a thing he does that can be part of many jobs (in that instance he could be a robber, assassin, mercenary, police marksman, soldier, etc) but it isn't in itself an occupation. Evil Tim (talk) 09:16, April 13, 2019 (UTC) :::::::"Scholar" isnt really a occupation either but it is on Arkhams infobox. Despite the section being called Occupation we do use it here to describe what a person does as opposed to their job. Having defected from Hell and basically ditching Fortuna would make invalidate any knighthood he had. LegionZero (talk) 19:33, April 13, 2019 (UTC) ::::::::Scholar is a lot closer to an occupation: in fact, historically it's one of the classifications used to frame the concept of an occupation (for example, ancient China's system of Four Occupations). And as said, he would almost certainly be a knight if he was a lord, and we have no idea if Fortuna would ever invalidate his title: given he was a figure of legend, that would be rather like removing the title of someone like King Arthur. It seems that far from doing that they started outright worshipping him, given what we see in DMC 4. Besides, Sanctus and Credo both call Sparda the dark knight, I'm sure they wouldn't do that if Fortuna regarded his title as nullified. Evil Tim (talk) 05:58, April 14, 2019 (UTC) :::::::::Scholar is not an occupation though. As far as i know King Arthur didnt abandon his kingdom. Dante also has the title of Legendary Dark Knight so Sparda doesn't have to actually be a knight to be called a knight. LegionZero (talk) 18:51, April 14, 2019 (UTC) ::::::::::He'd have to be a knight of Fortuna for Credo to call him that, though, given his personality: he'd be the first to take exception to that title if Sparda was regarded as having abandoned his duties. Evil Tim (talk) 19:03, April 14, 2019 (UTC) :::::::::::Credo called him the Dark Knight, which could have been a shortening of LDK, perhaps because they believe/know Sparda to be real they simply call him Dark Knight due to him not being a legend. LegionZero (talk) 19:42, April 14, 2019 (UTC) ::::::::::::Credo would not have called him that if Fortuna didn't regard him as a knight. If he were disgraced they wouldn't also treat him as their patron. What you are saying makes no sense. Evil Tim (talk) 19:58, April 14, 2019 (UTC) :::::::::::::Again, Dante is called LDK even though he is in no formal way a knight. Even Trish calls Sparda LDK even though he betrayed Hell. We don't have any confirmation that Sparda was a formal knight of any kind after leaving the Underworld. We don't use occupation here necessarily to be a job description, but what a character has a particular area of expertise in. LegionZero (talk) 22:47, April 14, 2019 (UTC) ::::::::::::::That's completely irrelevant because Sanctus and Credo don't call him that, which is the key point here. Two people from Fortuna, both members of a holy order that reveres Sparda, still think of him as a knight. This means Fortuna never stopped thinking of him as a knight. The fact that he's famed as a knight in the Underworld (even Phantom knows that) doesn't necessarily mean he was a knight in the Underworld, either: they could just as easily be addressing him by the title the humans gave him. Evil Tim (talk) 22:49, April 14, 2019 (UTC) :::::::::::::::DMC1 manual says he was a knight from the underworld and BtN established that Sparda was Mundus' right hand man, so yes he was a knight in the Underworld. Sanctus and Credo could be easily addressing him by his title from the Underwold. Without sufficient evidence that he was ever knighted while in the human world then his occupation will remain simply as swordsman. You are the only one arguing otherwise and if you continue with this edit war I will temporarily ban you. This back and forth is is getting out of hand. LegionZero (talk) 23:46, April 14, 2019 (UTC) ::::::::::::::::Like I said, being a lord without being a knight would be extremely unusual, and being addressed as a knight by humans would rather suggest he retained the job he already knew how to do. If an enemy defects and you trust him enough to let him fight for you, you're going to give him the same job he had before, that's common sense. Evil Tim (talk) 00:23, April 15, 2019 (UTC)